Milestone-Proposal talk:Kodak Digital Camera

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Proposal -- JaninA (talk) 13:56, 29 October 2017 (UTC)

Dear Proposer,

I wonder when do you plan to have the proposal completed.

Kind regards

Janina

Proposal -- JaninA (talk) 04:00, 27 April 2019 (UTC)

Dear Proposer,

it has been a long time since you submitted partly drafted nomination for Kodak Digital Camera 1973-1977 for the IEEE Milestone in 2017.

The History Committee would like to know reasons for which the proposal has not been completed till now. In case you need some assistance with the process to complete the submittal please do not hesitate to contact the Committee.

Sincerely

Janina Mazierska

Re: Proposal -- Wmyfowlkes (talk) 15:04, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

Replace this text with your reply

Janina, I don't understand. We completed all the paper work and I thought this was submitted in 2019. Bill Fowlkes

Proposal -- JaninA (talk) 01:37, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi Bill,

Thanks for the corrected version submitted on 20 March 2021. It starts looking good. So I will be contacting possible experts. In the meantime it might be worthy for you to look again at the section we discussed before and add a couple of sentences pointing the differences explicitly. Your necessary info is there now.

janina

Notes on Cromenco Cyclops -- Wmyfowlkes (talk) 17:32, 29 April 2021 (UTC)

Questions have been raised as to whether Kodak or Cromenco was truly the first to develop a working Digital Still Camera. The Cromenco CYCLOPS is an all-solid-state TV camera with a 1024 element MOS image sensor.  There is no storage and no digitization of the "pixels".  You have probably also seen this entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cromemco_Cyclops. The ambiguity comes from the use of the term "camera".  The Cromemco Cyclops has to be tethered to something to make use of the images that are generated.  the correct term should probably be "TV Camera".

We are careful to distinguish ourselves from this in the milestone application by referring to the device as a "self-contained hand-held digital camera"  Specifically in the box Kodak included camera optics, a charge-coupled device electronic light sensor, a temporary buffer of random-access memory, and image storage on a digital cassette.

The Cyclops was primarily a capture device and exported raw signals to be viewed on a CRT.  In addition, the Cyclops is primarily a motion video device, the title for our milestone clarifies that we are claiming a still image camera.  "First Hand-Held Portable All-Electronic Solid-State Still Camera, 1975"

Expert Opinion 1 uploaded on expert's behalf by Administrator4 -- Administrator4 (talk) 13:00, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

"It took me some time to look at the material and records, and I have asked further confirmation from an older colleague who has worked on the camera sensor development during the late 70s, and who is therefore familiar with these early pioneering devices. Our opinion is that the plaque wording is accurate, that the evidence provided is sufficient, and that the achievement is significant".

Expert opinion 2 uploaded on expert's behalf by Administrator4 -- Administrator4 (talk) 13:01, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

" 1) Is the suggested wording of the Plaque Citation accurate?

The wording does not include any inaccurate claims, but it is incomplete in that there is a huge void between the description of the device itself and the final statement that "The digital camera has revolutionized the way that images are captured ...". A description of how this first camera influenced the evolution of these later devices is entirely missing. A possible reason for this is that it appears that Eastman Kodak suppressed any development of the prototype as a consumer product out of fears for the effect on their film business, with the result that it had little or no actual influence on the evolution of digital cameras as they are today.

Given these observations, it would seem appropriate for the wording to (i) include the names of the engineers who designed it rather than just the name of the company that failed to recognize its value, and (ii) include some acknowledgement of the actual influence the device had in the history of digital camera development.

2) Is the evidence presented in the proposal of sufficient substance and accuracy to support the Citation?

The supporting texts and citations section is overly reliant on web page links, but there is a sufficiently diverse range of evidence, including an IEEE Spectrum interview with the engineer who designed the system, and reports of an IEEE award for this work, to provide reasonable confidence in the validity of the claims made in the Citation.

3) Does the proposed milestone represent a signicant technical achievement?

The technical achievement is indeed significant. While there were other contemporary devices for digital photography, the device in question was the first self-contained digital camera; in a sense, the ancestor of the digital cameras of today. The significance of this achievement is tempered by the absence of any evidence that this device had any significant influence on the subsequent evolution of digital cameras (see discussion in response to question 1.), but in my view the technical achievement is nevertheless deserving of the milestone designation, albeit with a less selective account of history than is contained in the proposed Citation."

Citation and expert opinions -- JaninA (talk) 14:35, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

Bill, comments of the second expert need to be addressed.